Post Reply 
Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
06-23-2014, 12:07 PM
Post: #46
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
(06-20-2014 08:57 PM)sput Wrote:  It really is, but when you think that Sutherland is still doing facial animation for both versions it kind of makes sense.

There were moments where Ocelot seemed like he was asking Snake a question and Snake didn't answer. It's pretty obvious why.

And the mo-cap alone is costing them too you know, it wouldn't surprise me if that's the reason why they cut down on his dialogue.

(06-20-2014 09:54 PM)Solidsuitlarry Wrote:  As long as Hayter remains Solid Snake then the English version has some hope.

I really doubt it. Hayter would be down to do it for sure, but there's no way in hell they would allow him back in the studio. It's a corporate anomaly.

Either they get Sutherland for another Solid Snake game (not directed by Kojima), or they'll probably get someone else altogether. That's my prediction.
QUOTE
06-23-2014, 11:59 PM
Post: #47
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
Did Hayter call Kojima a "dirty nip" or something and I missed it?

There seems to be some idea that besides being honest about his disappointment in being unceremoniously dropped from the series that something has happened which means he'd never ever be able to come back.

Really I'm asking here, I didn't even know Hayter was such a liberal douche til a few months ago so clearly I miss these things.

Here's my counter-offer to your counter-offer: Go Fuck Yourself!
QUOTE
06-24-2014, 12:56 AM (This post was last modified: 06-24-2014 02:25 AM by Ex-President.)
Post: #48
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
He's just bitter about the whole thing (can't blame him) and keeps making jokes about it every chance he gets.
I doubt Kojima even thinks about Hayter. He justs wants to hang around hollywood fags. (I'm thinking Avi Arad, Sutherland seems like a pretty likeable guy)

I don't think it's impossible to have him back, though.

EDIT:
[Image: twitterwolf.png]

Again?

Everyone should just shut up for a second.
QUOTE
06-24-2014, 06:48 AM
Post: #49
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
Yeah, don't be expecting David Hayter to give up half his fuckin payslip this time.

Here's my counter-offer to your counter-offer: Go Fuck Yourself!
QUOTE
06-24-2014, 08:49 AM
Post: #50
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
Jesus fucking Christ, I can't stand how everyone seems to think that "Oh, Big Boss isn't talking in this game, because Kiefer is sooo expensive!"

You guys really think that Kojima cut lines from his entire story after Kiefer was hired? Gimme a break. The amount of dialogue for Snake was set in stone a long time ago.

"When I first played Metal Gear Solid I was but a boy. Then after watching Snake and Meryl ride off into the sunset I was [SIC] suddenly had six hungry mouths to feed and a pile of bills to pay. Metal Gear ruined my childhood."

[Image: foxhoundmg2.gif]
QUOTE
06-24-2014, 08:48 PM (This post was last modified: 06-24-2014 08:48 PM by Shriveled_Snake.)
Post: #51
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
(06-24-2014 08:49 AM)Mexican Sting Wrote:  Jesus fucking Christ, I can't stand how everyone seems to think that "Oh, Big Boss isn't talking in this game, because Kiefer is sooo expensive!"

You guys really think that Kojima cut lines from his entire story after Kiefer was hired? Gimme a break. The amount of dialogue for Snake was set in stone a long time ago.

That's bullshit and you know it. Snake would have talked a billion lines by now if not for Kiefer, every trailer. It's not that he's expensive either, it's the allocation of spending. Do we want this grade-A Hollywood actor to mocap or voice act more?

There are obligations in the production of a game, especially with one so heavily obsessed with muh realism as its selling point.
QUOTE
06-24-2014, 08:54 PM
Post: #52
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
So just to clarify you're actually saying you think Kojima changed the entire script of his game when Kiefer was hired?

No, just no.

"When I first played Metal Gear Solid I was but a boy. Then after watching Snake and Meryl ride off into the sunset I was [SIC] suddenly had six hungry mouths to feed and a pile of bills to pay. Metal Gear ruined my childhood."

[Image: foxhoundmg2.gif]
QUOTE
06-25-2014, 12:09 AM
Post: #53
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
Either that or strong silent reboot.

Here's my counter-offer to your counter-offer: Go Fuck Yourself!
QUOTE
06-25-2014, 10:54 PM
Post: #54
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
(06-24-2014 08:54 PM)Mexican Sting Wrote:  So just to clarify you're actually saying you think Kojima changed the entire script of his game when Kiefer was hired?

No, just no.

Who needs to change a script? Kiefer was undoubtedly chosen before development even surfaced.
QUOTE
06-26-2014, 08:22 AM
Post: #55
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
Yes, but not before Kojima's ego was formed.

"When I first played Metal Gear Solid I was but a boy. Then after watching Snake and Meryl ride off into the sunset I was [SIC] suddenly had six hungry mouths to feed and a pile of bills to pay. Metal Gear ruined my childhood."

[Image: foxhoundmg2.gif]
QUOTE
07-01-2014, 07:47 AM
Post: #56
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
Kiefer was hired for motion capture, and the issue with that opening scene in the gameplay demo was that we're not given the full focus of what Snake's expressing because the one-track camera keeps veering off. The idea behind utilizing the facial mocap more was so Snake could express himself without having to always use words. Kojima brought up that "Kaz" example, and here with the opening it seems to follow the same format. Rather than questioning and using every opportunity to clarify what Ocelot is saying, we have Snake grinning and irking his face.

My issue is that they shouldn't have made Snake a complete mute during that. If you don't want him talking so much then that's fine, but in instances where Ocelot directly talks to him it would be less awkward to see Snake actually behave like a human and reply back. Case in point is when Ocelot asks if he's still getting used to his prosthetic. He just looks at the arm. A simple "sure" would have even sufficed over dead air.

And I thought the only mute in the game was supposed to be Quiet. Bad dum tish.

[Image: iEvhnuZkVdiu5.gif]
QUOTE
07-01-2014, 09:43 AM (This post was last modified: 07-01-2014 11:41 AM by sput.)
Post: #57
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
(07-01-2014 07:47 AM)Smiley Wrote:  ...we're not given the full focus of what Snake's expressing because the one-track camera keeps veering off.
We're going to see this a lot. I know it.

Quote:My issue is that they shouldn't have made Snake a complete mute during that.

Well you said it yourself, he was hired for a more subdued performance. It's just that we're used to the character being annoyingly vocal about everything. Then again, the guy was responsible for BB losing his eye, you don't think there would be at least some animosity?

Benny Harvey, RIP
QUOTE
07-01-2014, 05:34 PM (This post was last modified: 07-01-2014 05:40 PM by Smiley.)
Post: #58
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
I would expect a more human reaction between two characters, especially when the focus is on a sense of realism in expression. Games can get away with one over the other. There are games that lack detail in motion capture that still excel in their script and/or voice acting, and there are games with excellent motion capture that lack any dialogue or a vocal performance.

But Kojima's exploring the need to push on motion capture in a series that relies on its script and story. And he obviously cares about the acting or he wouldn't have used someone of Kiefer's caliber in the first place. And the scene was jarring, not because Snake doesn't talk as much as he does (or at all in this particular example), but because he lacks any believable reaction to Ocelot's one-man discussion. He doesn't respond in a way that details that Snake is aware of what he's doing beyond observing physical objects. And that takes away from the radio discussions that Ocelot brings up because if it's anything like Peace Walker/Ground Zeroes then it's going to be more of a one-man discussion. Part of the charm of the codec and radio was the conversations that would arise between Snake and the supporting cast. Their reactions to varied discussions felt more memorable than anything the motion capture has provided for Ground Zeroes, and I fear the same will be said for Phantom Pain. It's not completely abandoned though because of the cassette tapes, but those should not take up more of a discussion over actual cutscenes between characters.

[Image: iEvhnuZkVdiu5.gif]
QUOTE
07-01-2014, 05:38 PM
Post: #59
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
(07-01-2014 09:43 AM)sput Wrote:  Then again, the guy was responsible for BB losing his eye, you don't think there would be at least some animosity?

I have a feeling they'll never even mention it. Like Kojima forgot how BB lost the eye or something.

Here's my counter-offer to your counter-offer: Go Fuck Yourself!
QUOTE
07-01-2014, 09:06 PM
Post: #60
RE: Why Kiefer Sutherland? more than meets the eye
(07-01-2014 05:34 PM)Smiley Wrote:  It's not completely abandoned though because of the cassette tapes, but those should not take up more of a discussion over actual cutscenes between characters.
Most of the big discussions between characters was via codec to begin with and I honestly like the cassette tapes better because you can take them in whenever it's convenient for you, as opposed to having them take up large chunks of time in the middle of the game. It also makes it only an option for people who aren't really interested in that information.

---
Broken bones require different treatment than an infection does
---
PSN ID: DeadByDagger
Gamertag: xDeadByDaggerx
QUOTE
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)