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Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
04-14-2016, 11:32 PM
Post: #1
Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy.
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04-15-2016, 12:48 PM
Post: #2
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
Responses:

Mr. Wolfe's Meta Gear http://metagearsolid.org/2016/04/mgsv-pa...he-father/

/r/NeverBeGameOver https://www.reddit.com/r/NeverBeGameOver...ning_real/

/r/MetalGearSolid https://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/...ic_legacy/

Will update with more if and when I feel like it.

(05-22-2016 02:42 PM)Canucklehead Wrote:  The actual hero of Metal Gear is the player for putting up with all of its bullshit over the years.
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04-17-2016, 10:41 AM
Post: #3
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
That was really well done, and you make a very good point about how Big Boss was just manipulating the "medic", which is actually something I was thinking when I reached the end, though my mind was more about the "meta-narrative", seeing Big Boss's words as Kojima's message to us, since "Venom Snake" is obviously just the player, and I personally thought it was a wonderful message to the fans, "I'm you and you're me". But viewing it all as the story itself, yeah, Zero might have come up with this plan, but Big Boss willingly goes along with it.
You also make a great point, that I was worried you would miss, the fact that this game doesn't actually show the monster that Big Boss is. Most fans haven't played Metal Gear 2, the most important game that has Big Boss in it. That little bit of Big Boss we see in that game has more personality than all the Big Boss games combined, and this is the Big Boss I wanted to see in those games. I wanted to hear him explain his horrible philosophy, and to not only see him put it in action, but to have us, the players, be forced to go along with it, slaughtering villages, taking in the war orphans, and turning them into child soldiers, likely lying to them to make them think that someone else has done the massacre.
Instead, the game still on it's surface makes Big Boss out to be a hero. We don't really see much of Big Boss in the game, and it's easy to miss the obvious point that he's manipulating his best man. I didn't think of the mirror shattering the way you did, but now I see how true it is. The "medic" is rejecting his old self and just becoming a clone of Big Boss, losing his own identity. The thing is that we're still going to see lots of Big Boss fans who think he's the true hero and that Solid Snake, obviously the actual true hero of this series, as a little bitch who blindly followed Zero/The Patriots and killed the "true hero". I really wish that Kojima instead had just given us a game about how horrible war was, and did it well enough to sicken us, and make us question why we like war games.
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04-17-2016, 12:54 PM (This post was last modified: 04-17-2016 01:03 PM by jdnation.)
Post: #4
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
Excellent stuff!

Goes to prove that despite some of the hokey things Kojima does, Kojima's still got that MGS2-era genius in him!

MGSV is like the anti-thesis of MGS2.

One need only look at the ones lining up behind charismatic leaders/movements today to see the hapless easily fall into the same traps.

Ironic, given many of the same ones shouting about protecting or improving race relations or this or that minority or gender are easily co-opted and duped.

It's as if Quiet became a Red Herring in the affair so Kojima could make them ashamed of their words and deeds. Everyone speaking up for the lady who had no words to express herself at all.

We simply judged Quiet for what was on the surface, while blissfully wearing the skin of another man. And we see in the Skull Units not only the parasites that create an outer shell covering over the visage of the human being underneath it, but also that the human underneath can disappear altogether as exhibited by their powers.

Quiet doesn't wear that parasitic skin. She wants to maintain her identity also shown by her and Code Talker's shared hatred revenge. So Quiet exhibits her body openly in contrast to the Skull Parasite Unit members. Skullface also likewise exposes his scarred skin to the world but also hides behind a phantom mask.

Objectifying Quiet was also another point. It also served the narrative of the idealized Big Boss having relationships with attractive/dangerous women that all forms part of the lore/mystique and therefore the appeal of being Big Boss. You want to be him because he gets to have someone like her.

This may also be why the Phantom Boss speaks less. Aside from obviously not being Big Boss, he and Quiet are simply vessels into which we pour our own ideas and enforce our own perceptions upon. We are responsible for making him Big Boss just as much as the actual Big Boss, this is also shown by the manner of exploitation of Quiet by all sides.

But in the end it's merely a facade that we give up our individuality to be. We misunderstand Big Boss's motives the same way Big Boss and Zero misunderstood the Boss. And I think this is also why Kojima leaves us with a further option to either go for nuclear armament or disarmament, and also the whole point of the chain of retaliation where we only end up with endless warfare.

Just as cultures can be erased by one side dominating another by force, cultures also disappear when the people themselves willingly give it up for the superiority or conveniences of the other.

That's the whole dilemma of the language debate. It's not necessarily a binary good/evil thing. But the fact remains that something is lost. There is also the idea of misinterpretation. Not limited to just dialects, but also to motives and actions.

Another ironic example being that 'awanderingbard' moron on Reddit. Pls keep real-life consequences of war and murder outta my vidya games guys, k thanks! He's probably one of those same fools upholding abortion as a holy right while crying about pictures of the procedure being shown at pro-life events.
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04-17-2016, 09:29 PM (This post was last modified: 04-17-2016 09:29 PM by DarthCaligula.)
Post: #5
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
By the way, when does it show that part with Venom Snake having his head turn into a charred skull? It looks like it's after the mission when you gun down your infected crew, but I don't remember seeing that. Did it happen, and I missed it?
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04-18-2016, 02:02 AM
Post: #6
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
(04-17-2016 09:29 PM)DarthCaligula Wrote:  By the way, when does it show that part with Venom Snake having his head turn into a charred skull? It looks like it's after the mission when you gun down your infected crew, but I don't remember seeing that. Did it happen, and I missed it?

That was from a trailer:



(05-22-2016 02:42 PM)Canucklehead Wrote:  The actual hero of Metal Gear is the player for putting up with all of its bullshit over the years.
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04-18-2016, 08:16 PM
Post: #7
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
By the way, I think you need to work on balancing your audio in your videos. You tend to have the music much louder than your voice. I'll have the volume at a level where it's comfortable to hear the music, then your voice is a little too quiet, so I turn it up, and it makes the music get to the level where it isn't very comfortable. This one was done better than your "The Reality of Metal Gear Solid 2" video though.
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04-19-2016, 10:30 AM
Post: #8
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
(04-17-2016 12:54 PM)jdnation Wrote:  It's as if Quiet became a Red Herring in the affair so Kojima could make them ashamed of their words and deeds. Everyone speaking up for the lady who had no words to express herself at all.

We simply judged Quiet for what was on the surface, while blissfully wearing the skin of another man. And we see in the Skull Units not only the parasites that create an outer shell covering over the visage of the human being underneath it, but also that the human underneath can disappear altogether as exhibited by their powers.

Quiet doesn't wear that parasitic skin. She wants to maintain her identity also shown by her and Code Talker's shared hatred revenge. So Quiet exhibits her body openly in contrast to the Skull Parasite Unit members. Skullface also likewise exposes his scarred skin to the world but also hides behind a phantom mask.

Objectifying Quiet was also another point. It also served the narrative of the idealized Big Boss having relationships with attractive/dangerous women that all forms part of the lore/mystique and therefore the appeal of being Big Boss. You want to be him because he gets to have someone like her.

I never thought of her in this way but it makes so much sense. Nicely put!
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04-19-2016, 05:08 PM
Post: #9
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
I wanted to clarify something I said above, because I realize that it might not come across how I intended, about Venom Snake and the ending. What I mean when I say that I loved the message of "I'm you, and you're me" is that since Venom Snake is of course the player, this means that Big Boss would be Kojima, looking at things thematically and metaphorically. So that's why I loved the ending. Big Boss talks about the legend we've built together and things like that, and I took that as Kojima thanking us for playing his games, sticking with them, that Kojima and we the fans have sort of made Metal Gear together, and I thought it was a wonderful message as well as a great way to finally end the series for good. I never looked at this game as being part of the actual Metal Gear storyline, but instead as Kojima sending us a message, that this game is full of metaphors for how he felt about various things, mostly how he feels about working on Metal Gear and for Konami, and so I was always looking for what those messages meant instead of trying to figure out how it all fits together, which is something I abandonded quite a while ago.
I still think that Ravi's point stands though. Big Boss as depicted in this game really is a horrible manipulative bastard who ruined the life of his most loyal and trusted man from MSF, all to further his own goals, and what's really sad is that this man decides to abandon his individuality and just become a "phantom" of Big Boss.
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04-19-2016, 10:31 PM (This post was last modified: 04-19-2016 10:37 PM by appledoze.)
Post: #10
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
The interpretation of the ending as Kojima saying thanks to the player was the one most people seemed to accept at first but that's way too superficial and really has nothing to do with the underlying themes and the message Kojima is trying to get across.

The message BB gives Venom at the end is one that's interesting because it contradicts itself as it goes on. It starts with BB telling Venom, and by extension the player, that he's built his own legacy, left his own mark and has become his own man. Then he says together we built this legend of Big Boss and that we're both Big Boss. Then it ends by him flat out saying that YOU'RE Big Boss and that you're going to spread HIS legend. He slowly convinces you to accept the name of Big Boss and discard your identity for him. In fact it's doublethink. You're convincing yourself that you wanted this and that you are now your own legend while also believing that you're Big Boss and that you're furthering his legend.

And being Big Boss means of course that you'll face an existence of endless battle and become an enemy of the world. Even if we know the truth that Venom is actually a pretty swell guy that saves kids from war zones, as far as the clients who tasked you with killing the kids know, you "took care of them". So everyone else believes you are a warmongering monster because that's the legend and image you're spreading regardless of your actual actions. Just like the Boss, you become demonized and reviled and the world won't know the truth. And just like Skull Face, in the end you, as a phantom, will be erased from history.

Just like Zero and Skull Face, Big Boss seeks to enslave the world by promising it a false freedom. Zero seeks to have everyone conform to his ideology by controlling information so that the people believe they are willingly accepting and agreeing with his ideas. Skull Face wants to give everyone nukes but he still has control over them. And Big Boss wants to free soldiers by creating a world of endless war where they will die for him. This is exemplified by how he tells you you are a free man who left his mark on the world while in reality being a slave to Big Boss's will who will be sacrificed for his legend.

And of course, Big Boss is a huge hypocrite. He's disgusted by clones of him being made but seems to be fine with the idea of turning an adult man into a body double and erasing his memories and taking away his face. Perhaps because he fears the clones, he fears that they will surpass him, he fears they will prove to him that he could choose a life outside of battle but doesn't want to. But imposing his memories and identity on a person seems fine to him because he knows that they'll share his ideas. The game even tries to convince you that the whole thing was Zero's idea, it's all his fault! Okay, sure, Zero came up with this plan in order to protect BB, but BB had the choice to reject it, he had the choice to NOT take advantage of the situation and use it to further his own goals.

Big Boss ends up becoming a representative of ideologues and leaders who speak loftily, who promise glory and salvation, but won't make the necessary sacrifices for the cause themselves, they'll just shift that responsibility onto others, soldiers and followers. These are parasites that feed off the cycle of retaliation and revenge. He stands in contrast to characters like Gray Fox, Olga, the Boss, Naomi, Paz, and Quiet, people who made sacrifices for the greater good and for what they believed in, even if they would be misunderstood or reviled. Choice and sacrifice, big themes in the series.

Ultimately, Big Boss's fall doesn't come from him becoming a war-hungry maniac that butchers villages and shit. It comes from him rising to the status of a legend, an icon, a cult of personality and using others to further that legend and his cause. He ends up becoming a nebulous abstraction and ultimately a system, like the Patriots, that controls the fate of the world for its own ends. By doing so he directly spits in the face of the Boss and everything that she lived and died for. Big Boss's rise is his fall.
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04-19-2016, 11:05 PM
Post: #11
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
That's a really good point actually, about how he contradicts himself and changes the message in that recording he leaves for Venom Snake. I still think that the Kojima message works, but this all actually fits with the overall story of Metal Gear more than I thought.
And really, if Big Boss cared at all about his old number one man in MSF, instead of going along with Zero's plan and tricking the guy, he could have said in the hospital, right after taking out Quiet "Look, they changed your face, altered your mind. They want you to think you're me, your boss, Snake, Big Boss. But you're not, we have to fight this together." But no, he just goes along with it, wrapped up in his own legend and doing what he claims he hates governments for, using soldiers like they're nothing but tools.
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04-20-2016, 05:50 PM
Post: #12
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
By the way Ravi, I listened to some of those truth tapes again and I noticed that Big Boss possibly seems reluctant to use the medic like that when talking to Ocelot. Ocelot is saying that they need to use him to avert attention from what Big Boss is actually doing. It's hard to say if Big Boss doesn't want to use him like this. Does this go against your idea at all? In the end of course, Big Boss does lie to the guy, making him think that he really is Big Boss, so he's still manipulating him. Really, if Big Boss cared about this guy, shouldn't he tell him the truth, and say that they can work against Cipher together? Then again, the tape seems to suggest that Big Boss thinks that this plan was thought up by Ocelot and Eva if I understand correctly.
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04-22-2016, 12:44 PM
Post: #13
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
I already address that the body double was Zero's idea and why that's not a proper excuse. Without going too much into it, I can say that it wasn't Zero's plan to have Venom continue his role for over ten years.

(05-22-2016 02:42 PM)Canucklehead Wrote:  The actual hero of Metal Gear is the player for putting up with all of its bullshit over the years.
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04-22-2016, 04:10 PM
Post: #14
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
Hey, Venom is the best fanboy, he is happy to play the role and receive instruction via cassette.

We are all Decoy Octopus.
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04-23-2016, 01:48 PM
Post: #15
RE: Metal Gear Solid V: Parasitic Legacy
(04-22-2016 04:10 PM)jdnation Wrote:  Hey, Venom is the best fanboy, he is happy to play the role and receive instruction via cassette.

We are all Decoy Octopus.

https://twitter.com/thesnakesoup/status/...4277086208

(05-22-2016 02:42 PM)Canucklehead Wrote:  The actual hero of Metal Gear is the player for putting up with all of its bullshit over the years.
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